Caesar
Yeah, I know...a lot of this is on the "Police Brutality" thread, but this thing seems to be growing to the point were it should have its own thread.

This video is from Oakland (I think) of some folks breaking windows.
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Caesar
In a word where normal people did normal things and responded to things in normal ways, Trump would be setting his presidency on fire.

Quote:
Crossing State lines to incite violence is a FEDERAL CRIME! Liberal Governors and Mayors must get MUCH tougher or the Federal Government will step in and do what has to be done, and that includes using the unlimited power of our Military and many arrests. Thank you!

Why does he keep closing tweets with "Thank You!"?

[62736736-Palps-999] 
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Sparkle
Caesar wrote:

Why does he keep closing tweets with "Thank You!"?


Because he is an idiot.
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
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Detrimental
Who here went to protest?
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Caesar
Chicago cops wade into a crowd waving batons...

This IS 1968...
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Paquito
Trever Noah put out an completely fucking on point contextualization of the riots and looting that's been happening across the country. When the rest of society isn't upholding its side of the social contract, why the should they care about upholding theirs?

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Caesar
Paquito wrote:
Trever Noah put out an completely fucking on point contextualization of the riots and looting that's been happening across the country. When the rest of society isn't upholding its side of the social contract, why the should they care about upholding theirs?



I gotta be honest. It's making me really, REALLY angry that it's taken white folks so long to recognize how (and how often) they weaponize the police. I'm sort of glad that Amy Cooper has been a bit of a wake up call, but damn. What took y'all so fuckin' long?
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Caesar
Detrimental wrote:
Who here went to protest?

Nearest local protest isn't until tomorrow morning at 11:00, it's a couple cities away, but I'm thinking about dropping by.
Quote
booze
Caesar wrote:


I gotta be honest. It's making me really, REALLY angry that it's taken white folks so long to recognize how (and how often) they weaponize the police. I'm sort of glad that Amy Cooper has been a bit of a wake up call, but damn. What took y'all so fuckin' long?


Come on, Barenaked Ladies were singing about this in the 90's. 
 
Quote
Sparkle
Caesar wrote:


I gotta be honest. It's making me really, REALLY angry that it's taken white folks so long to recognize how (and how often) they weaponize the police. I'm sort of glad that Amy Cooper has been a bit of a wake up call, but damn. What took y'all so fuckin' long?


I think we've all been aware of it for a long time. Personally I have avoided posting about stuff like this for most of the time because I find it too upsetting. Like, how is my expressing outrage over and over again going to help? I don't even watch the news anymore.
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
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Putu
I’m really invested in the side stories of white agent provocateurs. There’s a lot of shady, shady shit.
That's...not what I meant at all.
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Ivan the Terrible
It's obviously impossible to say for certain, but I have to wonder just how much the pandemic played a role in the Floyd killing becoming the breaking point.

For a very brief period after the initial dismissal as a Democratic hoax, when people like Tom Hanks were getting sick, the pandemic was a shared crisis for the country...but then the numbers started coming out and increasingly showed that black people were disproportionately more likely to die from Covid-19. And, wouldn't you know it, Trump and his supporters very quickly pivoted to demands to open the economy and claims that the 'cure is worse than the disease.'

In other words, they made it abundantly clear that so long as it's black and brown people dying, they're pretty indifferent to how many people die. I've even seen some Trump supporters obliquely refer to the 'demographics' of the disease in justifying why they don't think the shutdown is worth the cost.

Tack on Amy Cooper and George Floyd in quick succession, and these last few weeks have been a banner period in making it obvious to everyone just how little black lives are valued in the United States.
It's the lack of stabbing that makes NoCrimesVille the kind of city I'm proud to live in.
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Jinnistan
Putu wrote:
I’m really invested in the side stories of white agent provocateurs. There’s a lot of shady, shady shit.

This appears to be the situation in Seattle, at least.
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Esoteric Allusion
It's obviously impossible to say for certain, but I have to wonder just how much the pandemic played a role in the Floyd killing becoming the breaking point.

For a very brief period after the initial dismissal as a Democratic hoax, when people like Tom Hanks were getting sick, the pandemic was a shared crisis for the country...but then the numbers started coming out and increasingly showed that black people were disproportionately more likely to die from Covid-19. And, wouldn't you know it, Trump and his supporters very quickly pivoted to demands to open the economy and claims that the 'cure is worse than the disease.'

In other words, they made it abundantly clear that so long as it's black and brown people dying, they're pretty indifferent to how many people die. I've even seen some Trump supporters obliquely refer to the 'demographics' of the disease in justifying why they don't think the shutdown is worth the cost.

Tack on Amy Cooper and George Floyd in quick succession, and these last few weeks have been a banner period in making it obvious to everyone just how little black lives are valued in the United States.
I think there's a more direct effect from the fact that lots of people are currently not working and are isolated or quasi-isolated from things they ordinarily do. That'll create lots of pent up frustration and time to do something about it.
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Sparkle
Police are marching with protesters in a number of cities across U.S.
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
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Flemstar
I live downtown Madison. My coworkers and I decided to close up our store cause shit hit the fan fast. It’s really tense here, also tear gas sucks.
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Esoteric Allusion
Flemstar wrote:
I live downtown Madison. My coworkers and I decided to close up our store cause shit hit the fan fast. It’s really tense here, also tear gas sucks.
May I ask which store?
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Flemstar
Chaos
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Flemstar
May I ask which store?


Capitol Centre Market
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Caesar
Sparkle wrote:


I think we've all been aware of it for a long time. Personally I have avoided posting about stuff like this for most of the time because I find it too upsetting. Like, how is my expressing outrage over and over again going to help? I don't even watch the news anymore.

That’s not the point. What would have been helpful I’d if you’d had conversations with other white folks to make them aware that they’re doing it, to help them see how dangerous it is and to get them to stop. 
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Caesar
It's obviously impossible to say for certain, but I have to wonder just how much the pandemic played a role in the Floyd killing becoming the breaking point.

For a very brief period after the initial dismissal as a Democratic hoax, when people like Tom Hanks were getting sick, the pandemic was a shared crisis for the country...but then the numbers started coming out and increasingly showed that black people were disproportionately more likely to die from Covid-19. And, wouldn't you know it, Trump and his supporters very quickly pivoted to demands to open the economy and claims that the 'cure is worse than the disease.'

In other words, they made it abundantly clear that so long as it's black and brown people dying, they're pretty indifferent to how many people die. I've even seen some Trump supporters obliquely refer to the 'demographics' of the disease in justifying why they don't think the shutdown is worth the cost.

Tack on Amy Cooper and George Floyd in quick succession, and these last few weeks have been a banner period in making it obvious to everyone just how little black lives are valued in the United States.


Floyd came after Atatiana Jefferson,  Breonna Taylor and Ahmaud Arbery and may have just been that straw. 
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Caesar
About 1,400 arrests, so far:
Quote:
Police have arrested nearly 1,400 people in 17 U.S. cities since Thursday as protests continue over the death of George Floyd.

[...]

The arrest has done little to quell protests across the country over the weekend. Most have been peaceful, but some have erupted in violence.

An Associated Press tally of arrests found at least 1,383 people have been arrested since Thursday. The actual number is likely higher as protests continue Saturday night.

More than a third of the arrests, 533, came from Los Angeles alone on Friday … The mayor of the nation’s second-largest city has imposed a citywide curfew until 5:30 a.m. Sunday.

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Caesar
Mayor of Atlanta Keshia Lance Bottoms gives what appears to be an impromtu speech last night.


Her message seems to be, "go home"--which I don't totally agree with--but she's also trying to stop the violence/destruction. I dig her passion.

I agree with her when she says, "...a protest must have purpose..." (which is why I'm calling what's going on an Uprising and not a riot).
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whic
Jinnistan wrote:

This appears to be the situation in Seattle, at least.

What specifically are you referring to here?
nothing.
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Jinnistan
whic wrote:

What specifically are you referring to here?

"They hijacked our protest."

[3be801e0-f8b9-4dfd-a6e8-172b7774fbef_1920x1080] 

I have yet to any acts of violence from someone who doesn't look like a black-bloc anarchist.
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whic
Seems like there was some of that but it doesn't appear to be worse than anywhere else. Definitely lots of pics/ footage/ reports of cops escalating.
nothing.
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MadMan
I've been working all weekend. I did see a protest in front of my store today. They organized and I think they headed downtown. 
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Dyne
Video of police taking potshots at people standing on their front porch, allegedly in Minneapolis. This is making the rounds on social media.

https://streamable.com/u2jzoo

A couple of things: 
 - I have yet to see a news source that confirms the location and date of this is incident. 
 - I have no idea the full context of this video. When you go through frame by frame, you see some of the people wearing bandannas over their face. It's possible that these were Antifa agitators or something, and this video was shot at a very opportune moment.

But...by the time humvees are rolling down the streets in nice looking neighborhoods shooting a white people, maybe the white electorate might start thinking this whole "authoritarian police state thing" is a bad idea. 
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Dyne
Paywalled article at WaPo:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/nation/2020/05/30/george-floyd-protests-live-updates/

Reposting here:

Quote:
Journalists become victims of the violence

As police relied on tear gas and rubber bullets to stymie protests around the country Saturday, many journalists covering their efforts became victims of the violence themselves. One jarring story came from freelance writer and photographer Linda Tirado, who was shot with a rubber bullet by Minneapolis police. Tirado tweeted that doctors told her she won’t regain vision in her left eye.

MSNBC Reporter Ali Velshi reported being shot with a rubber bullet by police in Minneapolis. “State Police supported by National guard fired unprovoked into an entirely peaceful rally,” he tweeted later, echoing observations shared by many journalists covering the protests there. Ryan Faircloth, an assignment editor for the Minneapolis Star-Tribune, was left bleeding from his face and his arm after he said law enforcement personnel shot rubber bullets through his car window as he was trying to leave the area where protests were happening. “It isn’t horrible but I am shook up. The window completely shattered and smoke filled the car,” he tweeted.

Los Angeles Times reporter Molly Hennessy-Fiske reported that she was among a group of journalists stationed outside Minneapolis’s 5th Police Precinct when officers came out and threw tear-gas canisters at them “at point blank range.” Hennessy-Fiske, who posted a picture of blood running down her leg where she believed she was hit with a rubber bullet, reported that reporters identified themselves as press and asked officers where they should go. She said the officers did not provide answers.

In Louisville, television reporter Kaitlin Rust and photographer James Dobson were filming a live hit when a law enforcement officer shot at them with what Rust believed to be pepper balls. “I’m getting shot! I’m getting shot!” Rust called. An anchor in the studio then asked if she could tell where the officer was aiming.“ Like, directly at us,” she replied.

By Chelsea Janes
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Dyne
It's obviously impossible to say for certain, but I have to wonder just how much the pandemic played a role in the Floyd killing becoming the breaking point.

For a very brief period after the initial dismissal as a Democratic hoax, when people like Tom Hanks were getting sick, the pandemic was a shared crisis for the country...but then the numbers started coming out and increasingly showed that black people were disproportionately more likely to die from Covid-19. And, wouldn't you know it, Trump and his supporters very quickly pivoted to demands to open the economy and claims that the 'cure is worse than the disease.'

In other words, they made it abundantly clear that so long as it's black and brown people dying, they're pretty indifferent to how many people die. I've even seen some Trump supporters obliquely refer to the 'demographics' of the disease in justifying why they don't think the shutdown is worth the cost.

Tack on Amy Cooper and George Floyd in quick succession, and these last few weeks have been a banner period in making it obvious to everyone just how little black lives are valued in the United States.


I think all of it contributed to a tipping point. American society has made it abundantly clear by this point that it doesn't care about the black community (or latino, or native american, or "fill in the blank vulnerable group"), and the past few years have just been reinforced by a power structure that actively ignores them, sacrifices their well-being for material gain, or outright calls for violence against them.  Back citizens watching a government that downplays the severity of the disease and bungles a response that plunges them further into poverty and disproportionately affects them, all while middle class white people complain about having to wear a mask at the Olive Garden has got to ramp up the feeling of being totally desperate. 
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Jinnistan
whic wrote:
Seems like there was some of that but it doesn't appear to be worse than anywhere else. Definitely lots of pics/ footage/ reports of cops escalating.

I didn't suggest that it was "worse than anywhere else", as there have been reports from several cities that those causing violence and property damage were not from the local communities or part of the organized protests.  And I don't see how this fact absolves the police from blame for their respectively disproportionate responses.  The former fact remains undeniable.
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Sparkle
Caesar wrote:

That’s not the point. What would have been helpful I’d if you’d had conversations with other white folks to make them aware that they’re doing it, to help them see how dangerous it is and to get them to stop. 


Not a single person I interact with is someone who would do this, they're all on the same side already. The only person I know who would pull an Amy Pusher is my father, and I have repeatedly called him out on his racism, and now I avoid him largely because of it. I'm not sure what else I can do.
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
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whic

I'm really nervous about everyone's willingness to pin all destruction on antifa as Trump threatens to designate them as a terrorist organization. For obvious reasons. White supremacist groups and neo-revolutionaries have been documented making plans to stoke the flames of race war. Undercover cops have been documented infiltrating and escalating. But, it also reduces the impact of black folks' protests, they are also out there breaking shit, as they should be. Don't take fact that away. 

It's just fucking stupid to imply that it's all antifa. 

nothing.
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wirthling
Motion to restore "antifa" to "antifascist" because the abbreviation is only reducing a four-syllable word to a three-syllable word and it's just a weird abbreviation....
"I am very poorly today and very stupid and hate everybody and everything." - Charles Darwin
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Ergill
wirthling wrote:
Motion to restore "antifa" to "antifascist" because the abbreviation is only reducing a four-syllable word to a three-syllable word and it's just a weird abbreviation....

Motion to rebrand as "Latifah" but more commonly known as "queens".
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wirthling
Prediction: FBI/DOJ will claim antifa is not entitled to civil rights protection because it is not an organized political entity and they will also claim antifa is an organized terrorist entity. And when a reporter asks if this is a contradiction they will cite the case of Look vs. Over There.
"I am very poorly today and very stupid and hate everybody and everything." - Charles Darwin
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wirthling
"antifash" at least has some zing to it
"I am very poorly today and very stupid and hate everybody and everything." - Charles Darwin
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Dyne
Ergill wrote:

Motion to rebrand as "Latifah" but more commonly known as "queens".

You're both wrong, I motion we remove and rearrange vowels to make it spelled like a tech startup - antyfyst. 
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Ergill
I'll forward these suggestions to my antifa sister to see if she can get them in the newsletter.
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Esoteric Allusion
wirthling wrote:
Prediction: FBI/DOJ will claim antifa is not entitled to civil rights protection because it is not an organized political entity and they will also claim antifa is an organized terrorist entity. And when a reporter asks if this is a contradiction they will cite the case of Look vs. Over There.
Bingo.

Meanwhile, the government has consistently refused to designate white supremacist groups that act like literal terrorist organizations as such. The argument, which I agree with mind you, is that this opens up the potential to abuse civil rights, including free speech activity, by bringing foreign military/intelligence tools against it.

But when right wing terrorist organizations are left alone while left-wing activity that is even harder to pin down as either an organization or terrorism is gone after, you're looking at something ugly.
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Caesar
Detrimental wrote:
Who here went to protest?

Nearest local protest isn't until tomorrow morning at 11:00, it's a couple cities away, but I'm thinking about dropping by.
Sparkle wrote:


Not a single person I interact with is someone who would do this, they're all on the same side already. The only person I know who would pull an Amy Pusher is my father, and I have repeatedly called him out on his racism, and now I avoid him largely because of it. I'm not sure what else I can do.

I'm sorry, but...
We don't believe you.jpg 
This is part of the problem. People will swear that they'd never do this, until they do. I'm sure that Amy Cooper would have said (before the incident in The Bramble) that she would never do anything like that. She even said this in an interview with CNN “I’m not a racist. I did not mean to harm that man in any way,”. 

She may not be "a racist", but her actions certainly were. She may not have meant "to harm that man", but her actions certainly could have.

The hardest part of this conversation is that white folks are going to react defensively. If you (general, non-white "you") attempt to have a conversation about white supremacy and how dangerous it is, most white folks will take that as an accusation ( and it is, kind of), and react with, "I'm not racist...I wouldn't do that". Missing the point. No one is calling you a racist (at least, I'm not). The hope is that people will see that prejudices exist ('cause everyone has them--and that doesn't make them a bad person) and how those prejudices manifest. Sometimes (as happened with Ms. Cooper) prejudices can manifest in a racist way. She said she got scared. What scared her? If she'd asked herself this during the encounter, things may have ended differently. That's a a lot to ask in the moment, I realize.

We (people in general) need to be better at detecting how we perceive those who aren't like us and how we react to it. This is one of those situations that won't get better until we all acknowledge that there's a problem (and what the problem is). and simply stating that "no one I know would do this" isn't helpful.
Quote
Caesar
whic wrote:

I'm really nervous about everyone's willingness to pin all destruction on antifa as Trump threatens to designate them as a terrorist organization. For obvious reasons. White supremacist groups and neo-revolutionaries have been documented making plans to stoke the flames of race war. Undercover cops have been documented infiltrating and escalating. But, it also reduces the impact of black folks' protests, they are also out there breaking shit, as they should be. Don't take fact that away. 

It's just fucking stupid to imply that it's all antifa. 


Back in the day (it was only a couple of years ago) when Antifa was in the news for demonstrations on college campuses, there was call to label them as a terrorist organization then. Short attention span was the only thing that tamped that down (some other issue came along to distract us). He's just back to using them as a convenient bogeyman.
Quote
Sparkle
Caesar wrote:

Nearest local protest isn't until tomorrow morning at 11:00, it's a couple cities away, but I'm thinking about dropping by.
Caesar wrote:

I'm sorry, but...
We don't believe you.jpg 
This is part of the problem. People will swear that they'd never do this, until they do. I'm sure that Amy Cooper would have said (before the incident in The Bramble) that she would never do anything like that. She even said this in an interview with CNN “I’m not a racist. I did not mean to harm that man in any way,”. 

She may not be "a racist", but her actions certainly were. She may not have meant "to harm that man", but her actions certainly could have.

The hardest part of this conversation is that white folks are going to react defensively. If you (general, non-white "you") attempt to have a conversation about white supremacy and how dangerous it is, most white folks will take that as an accusation ( and it is, kind of), and react with, "I'm not racist...I wouldn't do that". Missing the point. No one is calling you a racist (at least, I'm not). The hope is that people will see that prejudices exist ('cause everyone has them--and that doesn't make them a bad person) and how those prejudices manifest. Sometimes (as happened with Ms. Cooper) prejudices can manifest in a racist way. She said she got scared. What scared her? If she'd asked herself this during the encounter, things may have ended differently. That's a a lot to ask in the moment, I realize.

We (people in general) need to be better at detecting how we perceive those who aren't like us and how we react to it. This is one of those situations that won't get better until we all acknowledge that there's a problem (and what the problem is). and simply stating that "no one I know would do this" isn't helpful.


I understand what you're saying and maybe in the majority of cases you'd be right. However, no one I interact with would do this. I don't know know all white people simply because I'm white, and I have a small circle of friends. If you want to speak generally, fine, but if you're speaking specifically to me, it's not a problem for me or the white people I know, except for my Dad, who I don't speak to largely because he is racist. Like, how could I even convince you this is true? 
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
Quote
Caesar
Sparkle wrote:


I understand what you're saying and maybe in the majority of cases you'd be right. However, no one I interact with would do this. I don't know know all white people simply because I'm white, and I have a small circle of friends. If you want to speak generally, fine, but if you're speaking specifically to me, it's not a problem for me or the white people I know, except for my Dad, who I don't speak to largely because he is racist. Like, how could I even convince you this is true? 

You read my post--this part specifically--

Quote:
The hardest part of this conversation is that white folks are going to react defensively. If you (general, non-white "you") attempt to have a conversation about white supremacy and how dangerous it is, most white folks will take that as an accusation ( and it is, kind of), and react with, "I'm not racist...I wouldn't do that". Missing the point. No one is calling you a racist (at least, I'm not). The hope is that people will see that prejudices exist ('cause everyone has them--and that doesn't make them a bad person) and how those prejudices manifest. Sometimes (as happened with Ms. Cooper) prejudices can manifest in a racist way. She said she got scared. What scared her? If she'd asked herself this during the encounter, things may have ended differently. That's a a lot to ask in the moment, I realize.

And that was your response?
Quote
Dyne
Ergill wrote:
I'll forward these suggestions to my antifa sister to see if she can get them in the newsletter.

If you can get her to pitch it at the next anarchist potluck meeting, that would be great. 
Quote
Sparkle
Caesar wrote:

You read my post--this part specifically--

Caesar wrote:

And that was your response?


I knew you would say that, and okay, I should have responded specifically to that using that wording - but that IS what I was responding to. Shamon, already. If you want me to reflect more deeply on the prejudices I may hold, and to encourage my friends to do the same, then I will, but honestly, I do that already.
"We think it is more important to be right than it is to appeal to the humanity of people we disagree with." ~Hannah Gadsby
Quote
Esoteric Allusion
Flemstar wrote:


Capitol Centre Market
Glad your Ok. This wasn't as bad as, say, the Halloween riot, but it felt more menacing to me. Like it could've become much worse.
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Ivan the Terrible
So this happened to the Robert E. Lee statue in Richmond.

[image] 
It's the lack of stabbing that makes NoCrimesVille the kind of city I'm proud to live in.
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wirthling
Being in a minority on my IT team (only 2/5 white), I completely understand where Caesar is coming from.

Hardyhar.

But srsly, my boss is a horrible racist. He said at one point that Mexicans weren't getting hit as hard by the 'rona because 'they all do manual labor and so they're tough.' And he regularly rants about how the Chinese all eat bats. My boss is Indian, if that matters.
"I am very poorly today and very stupid and hate everybody and everything." - Charles Darwin
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Caesar
There was a protest here. A few dozen people gathered and held up signs. My city is odd that way. There are protests, but there are never marches. What ends up happening is that people will stand on a corner and get their message out as traffic passes them. Very peaceful. Law enforcement didn't even drop by until they were called when a man (apparently standing too close to the street) had a car run over his foot.

Daytona Beach protest-2-sm.jpg 
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